<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 TRANSITIONAL//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; CHARSET=UTF-8">
<META NAME="GENERATOR" CONTENT="GtkHTML/4.6.6">
</HEAD>
<BODY>
Patience, Stevan. Patience, please...<BR>
<BR>
jc<BR>
<TABLE CELLSPACING="0" CELLPADDING="0" WIDTH="100%">
<TR>
<TD>
--
<PRE>
Jean-Claude Guédon
Professeur titulaire
Littérature comparée
Université de Montréal
</PRE>
<BR>
<BR>
</TD>
</TR>
</TABLE>
Le vendredi 14 août 2015 à 12:28 -0400, Stevan Harnad a écrit :
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>
<PRE>
Perhaps it’s time for our newcomer, Nicolas Pettiaux, to stop posting for
a while and do a little reading to inform himself about OA and its (short)
history. Otherwise he is just making us recapitulate it for him.
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> On Aug 14, 2015, at 12:03 PM, Nicolas Pettiaux <<A HREF="mailto:nicolas@pettiaux.be">nicolas@pettiaux.be</A>> wrote:</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Dear</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> I appreciate these discussions and clarifications. For me, and for most </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> people who are nex to the subjects and I meet, "Gold open access" and </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> "green open access" are confusing terms, even though they have been used </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> for a long time in official documents.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Green refers to nature and gold to expensive. What else for newcomers (= </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> most people in fact) ?</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> And nature is not necessarily cheap, while gold is most of the time </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> expensive.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> What is "cheap open access" ? By cheap open access, I mean the full </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> price of publishing a work (most of the time online only) in such a way </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> that its overal price be as low as possible and ONLY reflect the actual </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> costs ?</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> The best method I can think of is forget about ANY journals, and </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> consider as "publication quality paper" a work that is published </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> anywhere online, be it on an institutional (open) repository or any </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> website. Stop counting papers but only refer to their quality as </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> measured for example effective evaluation of a committee made of human </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> beings and not anymore by any accounting technique. Yes, this would </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> suppose that on a per document base, or per person base, a committee </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> would have to do actual work. But this is done already for most grant </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> attribution or tenure selection processes. Maybe not yet by the actual </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> reading of the papers and comments about his own papers an authors would </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> write.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Comments on a public website where the paper is published could also be </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> taken into account in the evaluation.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Many people agree today to consider that the peer review system does not </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> work anymore due to a too large number of submitted papers and a too </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> large number of journals/reviews.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Is there any other solution than dumping the reviews, the journals, the </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> papers as they are evaluated and listed today ? I am not the one </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> proposing this . I have discussed the subject with Pierre-Louis Lions, a </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> famous French mathematician, professor at the College de France and </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> president of the board of the Ecole Normale supérieure who mentioned </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> such a procedure he would appreciate and support.</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Best regards,</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Nicolas</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> -- </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Nicolas Pettiaux, phd - <A HREF="mailto:nicolas@pettiaux.be">nicolas@pettiaux.be</A></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> Open@work - Une Société libre utilise des outils libres</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> </FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> _______________________________________________</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> GOAL mailing list</FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> <A HREF="mailto:GOAL@eprints.org">GOAL@eprints.org</A></FONT>
<FONT COLOR="#737373">> <A HREF="http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/goal">http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/goal</A></FONT>
_______________________________________________
GOAL mailing list
<A HREF="mailto:GOAL@eprints.org">GOAL@eprints.org</A>
<A HREF="http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/goal">http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/goal</A>
</PRE>
</BLOCKQUOTE>
</BODY>
</HTML>