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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body bgcolor=white lang=EN-GB link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>My suspicion is that the figure Alicia cites is the number of articles published OA as a percentage of the total number of articles published (suggesting that 96-97% of papers are still being published in subscription journals). If that is right, then we would seem to have two different questions:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>1)<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>First, how many articles are currently published OA rather than using the subscription model. If this is the question that Alicia was answering then her estimate would seem to be lower than previous estimates (In June 2011, for instance, the estimate was 10% (<a href="http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/30686/title/Open-and-growing/flagPost/55748/">http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/30686/title/Open-and-growing/flagPost/55748/</a>), and earlier this year it was estimated at 17% (<a href="http://www.biomedcentral.com/1741-7015/10/124">http://www.biomedcentral.com/1741-7015/10/124</a>). It would certainly be useful to have further data from Alicia in order to understand why her figure is lower. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>2)<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Second, there is my question, which was “what percentage of papers(not journals, but papers) published Gold OA today incur no APC charge”. Hans referred to a blog post by Mike Taylor which cites a 2010 study. This, reports Taylor, found that half of the authors who had published in an OA journal had paid no APC at all. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Taylor also cites a Solomon and Björk analysis (<a href="http://www.openaccesspublishing.org/apc2/preprint.pdf">http://www.openaccesspublishing.org/apc2/preprint.pdf</a>) which found that the average APC paid was $906. I believe this latter study included a number of publishers based in the developing world, which charge lower APCs. It also appears to have used for its sample quite a few publishers that are included on Jeffrey Beall’s list of predatory publishers. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Richard Poynder<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:windowtext'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:windowtext'> goal-bounces@eprints.org [mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Hans Pfeiffenberger<br><b>Sent:</b> 12 December 2012 23:15<br><b>To:</b> Global Open Access List (Successor of AmSci)<br><b>Subject:</b> [GOAL] Re: Interview with Harvard's Stuart Shieber<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Hi Alicia,<br><br>an hour before your mail, I suggested a blog article which seems to say that about 50% of all gold OA journals do not ask for APCs at all and APCs were indeed not paid for by half of all Gold OA articles. <br><br>This is not reconcilable with the 3-4% you report. Are we perhaps talking about completely different ratios?<br><br>best,<br><br>Hans<br><br>for your convenience: the link, again, was: <a href="http://svpow.com/2012/12/10/what-does-it-cost-to-publish-a-gold-open-access-article/">http://svpow.com/2012/12/10/what-does-it-cost-to-publish-a-gold-open-access-article/</a><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Am 12.12.12 13:59, schrieb Wise, Alicia (ELS-OXF):<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hi Richard,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>My colleague does an in-depth annual study on the uptake of different business models, and suggests that this figure was 3-4% of total articles at the start of 2012. Elsevier, and I’m sure a wide array of other publishers, have used a range of business models to produce free-to-read journals for decades. I find it very interesting that these models are now claimed by the open access community as ‘gold oa’ titles although I suppose that’s much less of a mouthful than ‘free-at-the-point-of-use’ titles! </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>With kind wishes,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Alicia</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org">goal-bounces@eprints.org</a> [<a href="mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org">mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Richard Poynder<br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 12, 2012 8:42 AM<br><b>To:</b> 'Global Open Access List (Successor of AmSci)'<br><b>Subject:</b> [GOAL] Re: Interview with Harvard's Stuart Shieber</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks for the comments David. Your point about not equating Gold OA with APCs is well taken.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D'>But it also invites a question I think: do we know what percentage of papers(not journals, but papers) published Gold OA today incur no APC charge, and what do we anticipate this percentage becoming in a post-Finch world?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D'> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D'>Richard</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Andalus","serif";color:#1F497D'> </span></i><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org">goal-bounces@eprints.org</a> [<a href="mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org">mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>David Prosser<br><b>Sent:</b> 11 December 2012 19:53<br><b>To:</b> Global Open Access List (Successor of AmSci)<br><b>Subject:</b> [GOAL] Re: Interview with Harvard's Stuart Shieber</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>As ever, Richard has put together a fascinating and entertaining interview, and augmented it with a really useful essay on the current state of OA policies.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I have a small quibble. On page two, Richard writes:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>"...or by means of gold OA, in which researchers (or more usually their funders) pay publishers an article-processing charge (APC) to ensure that their paper is made freely available on the Web at the time of publication."</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>APCs make up just one business model that can be used to support Gold OA. Gold is OA through journals - it makes no assumption about how the costs of publication are paid for. I think it is helpful to ensure that we do not equate Gold with APCs.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'>David</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 3 Dec 2012, at 18:51, Richard Poynder wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></p><blockquote style='margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>Stuart Shieber is the Welch Professor of Computer Science at Harvard University,<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><a href="http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/people/sshieber"><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>Faculty Co-Director</span></i></a></span><span class=apple-converted-space><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'> </span></i></span><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>of the<span class=apple-converted-space> </span></span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><a href="http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/people/sshieber"><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>Berkman Center for Internet and Society</span></i></a></span><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>, Director of Harvard’s Office for Scholarly Communication (</span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><a href="http://osc.hul.harvard.edu/"><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>OSC</span></i></a></span><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>), and chief architect of the Harvard Open Access (</span></i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_access"><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>OA</span></i></a></span><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'>) Policy — a 2008 initiative that has seen Harvard become a major force in the OA movement.</span></i><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS , sans-serif","serif"'> </span></i><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a href="http://poynder.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/the-oa-interviews-harvards-stuart.html">http://poynder.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/the-oa-interviews-harvards-stuart.html</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif"'><ATT00001..txt></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><pre>Elsevier Limited. Registered Office: The Boulevard, Langford Lane, Kidlington, Oxford, OX5 1GB, United Kingdom, Registration No. 1982084 (England and Wales).<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre><pre>GOAL mailing list<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="mailto:GOAL@eprints.org">GOAL@eprints.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a href="http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/goal">http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/goal</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre><pre><o:p> </o:p></pre></blockquote><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>