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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>There’s also the considerable risk that the journal will not be sustainable under such a model. Once the volunteers lose interest, retire, or whatever, others may not be willing to take on the work and the institution behind it may no longer want to support it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>As Sally said, there are real costs to such enterprises, they are just well masked within the infrastructure and staffing budgets for the sponsoring organizations.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Brush Script MT";color:#632423'>Mary Summerfield<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Lucida Calligraphy";color:#632423'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>Publications Business Development Manager<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>SPIE<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>+1 360 685 5588 (Office)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>+1 360 647 1445 (Fax)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#C00000'><a href="mailto:marysu@SPIE.org"><span style='color:#C00000'>marysu@SPIE.org</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#C00000'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>SPIE is the international society for optics and photonics.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#C00000'><a href="http://www.spie.org/"><span style='color:#C00000'>SPIE.org</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>Learn about </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#C00000'><a href="http://spie.org/x31646.xml"><span style='color:#C00000'>SPIE Press Books</span></a> </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>and </span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#C00000'><a href="https://spie.org/documents/publications/journals/journal-brochure-10-11-L.pdf"><span style='color:#C00000'>SPIE Journals</span></a></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'>.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#632423'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#632423'>SPIE CONFIDENTIAL<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:#632423'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> goal-bounces@eprints.org [mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Sally Morris<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 07, 2012 8:00 AM<br><b>To:</b> 'Global Open Access List (Successor of AmSci)'<br><b>Subject:</b> [GOAL] Re: Planning for the Open Access Era<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Do you think that doesn't entail cost?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>The people who are doing this work 'free' (and the computer services provided 'free', etc) are all in reality being paid by someone to do their 'real' jobs. And, presumably, the amount of time devoted to those 'real' jobs is accordingly reduced.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Sally</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Sally Morris</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>South House, The Street, Clapham, Worthing, West Sussex, UK BN13 3UU</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Tel: +44 (0)1903 871286</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Email: <a href="mailto:sally@morris-assocs.demon.co.uk">sally@morris-assocs.demon.co.uk</a></span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><hr size=3 width="100%" align=center></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a href="mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org">goal-bounces@eprints.org</a> <a href="mailto:[mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org]">[mailto:goal-bounces@eprints.org]</a> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Peter Murray-Rust<br><b>Sent:</b> 07 August 2012 15:12<br><b>To:</b> Global Open Access List (Successor of AmSci)<br><b>Subject:</b> [GOAL] Re: Planning for the Open Access Era</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 11:27 AM, Sally Morris <<a href="mailto:sally@morris-assocs.demon.co.uk" target="_blank">sally@morris-assocs.demon.co.uk</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal>We should not delude ourselves; journals can only be 'free' if someone pays<br>the costs.<br><br>All the work involved in creating and running a journal has to be paid for<br>somehow - they don't magically go away if a journal is e-only (in fact,<br>there are some new costs, even though some of the old ones disappear).<br><br>I can only see three options for who pays: reader-side (e.g. the library);<br>author-side (e.g. publication fees); or 'fairy godmother' (e.g. sponsor).<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><br>There is a fourth option, which works: the scholarly community manage publication through contributed labour and resources and the net amount of cash is near-zero. This is described in <a href="http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/pamphlet/2012/03/06/an-efficient-journal/">http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/pamphlet/2012/03/06/an-efficient-journal/</a> where the J. Machine Learning Research is among the highest regarded journals in the area (top 7%) and free-to-authors and free-to-readers. There is an enlightening debate (on this URL) between those who run the journal and Kent Anderson of the Scholarly Kitchen who cannot believe that people will run and work for journals for the good of the community.<br><br>There is no law of physics that says this doesn't scale. It is simply that most scholars would rather the taxpayer and students paid for the administration publishing (either as author-side or reader-side) so the scholars don't have to do the work. And they've managed ot get 10 B USD per year. If scholars regarded publishing as part of their role, of if they were prepared to involved the wider community (as Wikipedia has done) we could have a much more C21 type of activity - innovative and valuable to the whole world rather than just academia. It would cost zero, but it would be much cheaper than any current model.<br><br>And of course we now have a complete free map of the whole world (<a href="http://openstreetmap.org">openstreetmap.org</a>) which is so much better than other alternatives that many people and organizations are switching to it. And, for many years, it didn't have a bank account and existed on "marginal resources" from UCL (and probably still does).<br><br>But most people will regard this as another fairy tale.<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><p class=MsoNormal><br clear=all><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=MsoNormal><br>-- <br>Peter Murray-Rust<br>Reader in Molecular Informatics<br>Unilever Centre, Dep. Of Chemistry<br>University of Cambridge<br>CB2 1EW, UK<br>+44-1223-763069<o:p></o:p></p></div></body></html>