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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt
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[SH]: So all in all, both data OA and Libre OA face problems that
Green<br>
Gratis OA does not face.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
[PM-R] And they deserve careful, accurate discussion.<br>
</div>
<br>
>> <br>
<br>
I agree. It seems that there is much to be explicated here,
particularly as data OA relates to the wider OA movement.<br>
<br>
Meanwhile, here is another link for those interested in the topic
(if they haven't come across it already): <br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://caseybergman.wordpress.com/2012/03/02/why-are-there-so-few-efforts-to-text-mine-the-open-access-subset-of-pubmed-central/">http://caseybergman.wordpress.com/2012/03/02/why-are-there-so-few-efforts-to-text-mine-the-open-access-subset-of-pubmed-central/</a><br>
<br>
Richard Poynder<br>
<br>
<br>
Peter Murray-Rust wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAD2k14NLJk8z__8SUgTEvMj9x4r0iZ0DTDF5F76nc+u=T6nsbw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, May 7, 2012 at 11:11 PM, Stevan
Harnad <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:harnad@ecs.soton.ac.uk" target="_blank">harnad@ecs.soton.ac.uk</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
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Richard, you are quite right that making research data open
for all<br>
to mine is not the same thing as making the texts of research
articles<br>
(Libre) OA for text-mining, and you are also right that there
are<br>
different problems associated with each.<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<div>I should point out that Libre OA as defined by Suber-Harnad
does not automatically give rights for textmining. Libre OA
indicates that "some permission barriers are removed" - it
does not indicate what those barriers are. For example by
default an toll-access article may not be posted in an
Institutional repository. The permission to post it is the
removal of a barrier. However that permission does not allow
text-mining as the copyirgh and re-use rights remain with
other parties (publisher or repository or both). For this
reason the phrase "LibreOA" is operationally meaningless - it
may have political value. Wiley claims "fully open access" for
its Gold hybrid and no doubt would label it as LibreOA but I
can see no difference between it and publisher-supported Green
OA other than that Wiley is 3000 USD better off and the
research community is worse and that the authors can claim
they have "Gold OA".<br>
<br>
I urge people to realise that textmining requires an explicit
statement of rights of re-use. <br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
Making article texts open for text-mining calls for Libre OA.
</blockquote>
<div><br>
Specifically it calls for BOAI-compliant LibreOA, not just
"LibreOA". It also calls for clear licensing with something
equivalent to CC-BY or CC0.<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><br>
But few publishers endorse Libre OA, for fear of 3rd-party
free-riders.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
BMC and PLoS do this enthusastically. I have seen no serious
evidence of free-riders.<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
(Moreover, some flavors of Libre OA call for further re-use
rights<br>
that even some authors would not wish to grant.)<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
This statement is made without evidence and is typical of some
of the casual and damaging inaccuracies made in this debate. I
have no evidence that people fail to publish in PLoS and BMC
because of their worry about re-use. <br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<br>
So all in all, both data OA and Libre OA face problems that
Green<br>
Gratis OA does not face.<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
And they deserve careful, accurate discussion.<br>
<br>
</div>
P.<br>
<br>
</div>
-- <br>
Peter Murray-Rust<br>
Reader in Molecular Informatics<br>
Unilever Centre, Dep. Of Chemistry<br>
University of Cambridge<br>
CB2 1EW, UK<br>
+44-1223-763069<br>
<br>
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