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<div id="smartTemplate4-template">Apologies, my previous email was a
little bit flippant on this issue! I agree we need to try and
store authenticated ORCIDs wherever possible. To that end we're
working on adding an annotation system so that where an ORCID is
imported from a trustworthy upstream system, this bit of
provenance is stored and we know not to try and check this ORCID
against a user account.<br>
<br>
The alternative approach would be to introduce a notion of
guest/external users to EPrints so that when external authors are
added we can store the fact that this user was added via a
trustworthy upstream system and we have an actual user object for
them.<br>
<br>
Ultimately I believe ORCID themselves would prefer the idea that
the repository emails the external author and so the author can
authenticate their ORCID - this too would no doubt be easier to do
with a guest/external user type, but should the ORCID plugin(s) be
introducing new user types and muddying the user dataset?<br>
<br>
Many thanks,<br>
<br>
Will<br>
<br>
<p><br>
</p>
</div>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div id="smartTemplate4-quoteHeader"><br>
<hr>
<b>From:</b> John Salter [<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:J.Salter@leeds.ac.uk">J.Salter@leeds.ac.uk</a>]
<b>Sent:</b> 02 August 2018 11:32
<b>To:</b> Eprints-tech
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update
<br>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">></span>
This naturally poses a problem for storing ORCIDs for external
authors, but in my experience most repositories are happy
storing ORCIDs for just their own users.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">This
concerns me. We (repository developers) shouldn't be
encouraging a blinkered approach to ORCIDs (or other
persistent identifiers).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">You
wouldn't exclude a DOI for a paper if it wasn't minted by your
institution - so why would you choose to discard ORCIDs for
non-local members?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">If
the ORCID has come from a trustworthy upstream system (e.g.
CrossRef, PubsRouter), then the ORCID should stay with the
author.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Local
ORCIDs can supplement this data - so a record harvested from
your repository is 'improved'.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I
was reading this:
<a
href="https://support.crossref.org/hc/en-us/articles/214567746-Authors-and-editors"
moz-do-not-send="true">
https://support.crossref.org/hc/en-us/articles/214567746-Authors-and-editors</a>
recently - and wondering what the 'authenticated="true"'
attribute actually meant - and how the this assertion should
be passed between systems.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">If
a *<b>trusted</b>* upstream system states that an ORCID is
authenticated - can we as a consumer of that data also state
that the ORCID is authenticated when relaying data from our
system?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">The
ORCIDs should be seen as an 'additive' set of data - if your
system can state that an author now has an ORCID - do it.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Just
don't throw away data that already exists for non-local
authors.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US">John<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D;mso-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US"> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk">eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk">mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Will Fyson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 02 August 2018 10:59<br>
<b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk">eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div id="smartTemplate4-template">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Tomasz,<br>
<br>
The ORCID Support Advance plugin does only allow ORCIDs to be
stored against creators/editors if they can be matched to a
user via the 'Email' column in all circumstances (to
facilitate the read-only nature of the field). Therefore
ORCIDs added through use of the ORCID Support plugin are
affected by this too.<br>
<br>
When we've been installing the Advance plugin on repositories
we've been encouraging administrators to tidy up their ORCID
data so that the ORCIDs stored are matched with user profiles.
This naturally poses a problem for storing ORCIDs for external
authors, but in my experience most repositories are happy
storing ORCIDs for just their own users.<br>
<br>
If an email isn't present in the creator/editor field, but an
ORCID is, the ORCID would be removed the next time the EPrint
is recommitted. The ORCID Support Advance plugin contains a
pre-commit trigger that updates the ORCID field based on the
email column to help keep the record up to date. These
triggers are disabled by default when the plugin is installed
however to prevent any accidental erasing of data by
installing the plugin. (the fields are read-only upon
installing the plugin however and so until the triggers are
re-enabled the content of the creator/editor ORCID fields is
essentially fixed.)<br>
<br>
I hope this helps answer your questions!<br>
<br>
Many thanks,<br>
<br>
Will <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div id="smartTemplate4-quoteHeader">
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:center" align="center">
<hr width="100%" size="2" align="center">
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Tomasz Neugebauer [<a
href="mailto:Tomasz.Neugebauer@concordia.ca"
moz-do-not-send="true">Tomasz.Neugebauer@concordia.ca</a>]
<b>Sent:</b> 01 August 2018 17:50 <b>To:</b> Eprints-tech <b>Subject:</b>
Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Hi
everyone who has installed the ORCID Support Advance plugin,
Will…</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
am still looking to get a clearer picture of what I can expect
to happen when I install the ORCID Support Advance plugin on
top of the ORCID Support plugin that we currently have
working.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">What
will happen to the ORCID ID’s that we have already collected
in the author field of publications?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The
description from Will below about ORCIDs from a DOI import
says this:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">“</span>,
the ORCID field uses the creator/editor 'Email' column to lookup
user profiles in the repository that have connected to orcid.org
so that the creator/editor ORCID field can be verified. As such
any ORCID added via a DOI import, might then be erased if the
user profile lookup cannot be made. “<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Does
the above also apply to any ORCIDs that we have been
collecting using the ORCID Support plugin?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
don’t think that our depositors have been diligently filling
in the email column in the author field during the deposit
process, does that mean that the user profile lookup will fail
and the ORCID will be deleted for any author that doesn’t have
an email listed in the author column?
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">When
does this deletion happen, during indexing? Is there any way
to prevent it from happening?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Thanks
so much for any insight or advice on this is really
appreciated.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Tomasz</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"> </span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"
lang="EN-US">
<a href="mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk"
moz-do-not-send="true">eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk</a>
<a href="mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk"
moz-do-not-send="true"><eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Will Fyson<br>
<b>Sent:</b> July 11, 2018 10:16 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk"
moz-do-not-send="true">eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div id="smartTemplate4-template">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Everyone,<br>
<br>
A couple of minor updates have been applied to the ORCID
Support Advance plugin, bringing it up to version 1.3.2.<br>
<br>
The updates are only very minor, fixing issues where the
plugin was generating a few too many messages in the indexer
and error logs. A Change Log documenting these most recent
changes is available at
<a href="https://wiki.eprints.org/w/ORCID_Support"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://wiki.eprints.org/w/ORCID_Support</a><br>
<br>
Regarding the discussion a couple of emails above in the
EP-Tech list ("Import by DOI in ORCID plugin"), a new DOI
imported that takes ORCIDs into account is not available at
present. Due to the requirements that the ORCID field must be
readonly when connected to the member API so that ORCIDs can
only be added via an authoritative source, the ORCID field
that is added to the creator/editor tables cannot be edited.
Therefore to stop values from being entered, which then later
cannot be removed, the ORCID field uses the creator/editor
'Email' column to lookup user profiles in the repository that
have connected to orcid.org so that the creator/editor ORCID
field can be verified. As such any ORCID added via a DOI
import, might then be erased if the user profile lookup cannot
be made. <br>
<br>
This is an issue we're looking into resolving however and so
hopefully we should have some updates on it in the future!<br>
<br>
Many thanks,<br>
<br>
Will<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
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